How to insulate without isolating from the world
What Mordecai can teach us about working in exile, why Christy sees teaching in public schools as a form of justice, and how to insulate without isolating from the world.
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[00:00:05] JR: Hey, friend. Welcome to the Mere Christians Podcast. I’m Jordan Raynor. How does the gospel influence the work of mere Christians; those of us who aren’t pastors or religious professionals but who work as psychologists, police officers, and sculptors? That's the question we explore every week. Today, I'm posing it to one of my best friends in the world, Christy Adams.
She's got no book. She's got no platform. She's just a mere Christian, working as a middle school Spanish teacher in the public-school system. Christy is one of the very, very few people who has been on the podcast more than once. Very short list. I think it’s like Christy, Dr. Keller, John Mark Comer. That's about it.
Christy and I recently sat down to talk about what Mordecai in the book of Esther can teach us about working faithfully in exile. We talked about why Christy sees teaching in public schools as a form of justice, and how we believers can insulate without isolating and retreating from the world. This is one of the more fun conversations I've ever had on the show, but also one of the most meaningful. Please enjoy this terrific conversation with my friend Christy Adams.
[EPISODE]
[00:01:24] JR: Christy Adams, welcome back to the podcast, my friend.
[00:01:28] CA: Thank you, Jordan.
[00:01:30] JR: I think this is a fun way for our listeners to get to know you. On one of our more recent double dates with our spouses, I think it was you who forced the group to answer a question I'm now going to force you to answer publicly. If Christy were a Netflix series, what three adjectives would Netflix list to describe the Christy Adams show?
[00:01:51] CA: That's a great question. One I'm going to answer at the end to keep the listeners guessing.
[00:01:55] JR: So that you can come up with an answer?
[00:01:58] CA: Exactly.
[00:01:59] JR: Kara's answer for me was not safe for work. So, we'll come back to your answer at the end.
[00:02:04] CA: It was accurate.
[00:02:04] JR: But accurate. Hey, how long have you been teaching middle school? It's been a while now. You're getting old.
[00:02:10] CA: Nineteen long years.
[00:02:12] JR: Oh, my gosh. I didn't realize it was 19.
[00:02:15] CA: Yes. Amazing and long years.
[00:02:20] JR: Amazing and long years. We've talked a lot about this privately. I'd love to talk about this now. Why public schools? You could teach anywhere, you're very intentional about teaching the public-school system, why?
[00:02:32] CA: Why? Well, I know that we're going to have a limit on time. So, I'll give you just a couple reasons. It's kind of similar. We were talking about orphan care and the foster care system pretty recently. It's kind of a similar reason. I'm very, very passionate about the public-school system, and just feel like when Christians remove themselves from the public-school system, when they remove themselves from foster care, they're missing a huge blessing and opportunity just to be alight and what can sometimes will always a dark place in foster care and sometimes a dark place when the public-school system. Because I mean, multiple kids, I know, I'm the only Christian that's in their life.
Well, first of all, when you describe the public-school system as being, like, increasingly dark or whatever, I don't really buy into that whole mindset.
[00:03:21] JR: Yes, tell us why.
[00:03:22] CA: So, I feel like there's a narrative of everything getting so much more sinful than ever, like Satan and Target are out to get our kids and –
[00:03:31] JR: And Starbucks. Don't miss Starbucks.
[00:03:34] CA: Yes. I feel like Satan has always been out to get our kids. Obviously, he's always been out to change the narrative. He's always tried to get us to change what God says, to make us doubt His goodness, His sovereignty, going back to Eve. So, all of this mess about schools, allowing teachers to pray over the kids in the fifties, or whatever, I think, okay, well, those kids were sitting in segregated schools. So, the devil was very much on the prowl back then as well. As long as I'm allowed to teach, there will be prayer in schools. I pray for my kids every day, sometimes out loud during the moment of silence.
It might be tempting sometimes for me to deal with fewer issues with what I can or can't say to my kids, or might be tempting for me to want to isolate my children, or myself from the world. But I know that my kids are learning so much from a diverse student population. They've had tons of conversations with kids in their classrooms. They're learning to be salt and light.
I think the professional development I do in the public-school system, and the professional development my kids do, provides our kids with a phenomenal education. I would like to – I want to bring those skills that God has gifted me with, to kids in a public school setting specifically, because I think it provides the most equitable education for everyone. I think that public schools serve as a way to fulfill Micah 6:8. I feel like kids deserve a great education regardless of their background, their situation, the money they have at home.
I think, just like with foster care and orphan care that we were talking about the other day, I think that is justice to provide them with that. It's not a great sacrifice for me to do this. I feel like it's what kids deserve. Not that I'm something amazing, awesome, and “Oh, they deserve whatever.” But I feel like we should reflect that God is just in how we view and carry out our work in the public schools.
[00:05:26] JR: You think you connect that to the decision to choose public schools? You think that's an act of justice?
[00:05:33] CA: Yes. Because I think it's the most equitable thing we can offer.
[00:05:36] JR: Yes, I agree.
[00:05:38] CA: Not just – I don't know how many teachers are listening, but for the parents that have kids in the public-school system, that's important for them too, to volunteer and to mentor kids and to serve in whatever way they can too.
[00:05:52] JR: So, you've been at this for 19 years, I have to imagine that the last few years have been particularly hard. Your jobs gotten harder, right? I think everyone's job has gotten harder, but definitely teachers, right?
[00:06:02] CA: Yes.
[00:06:04] JR: And over dinners, over the last few years with our spouses, I think I've heard you maybe for the first time ever talk about like, “Man, kind of want to quit. I'm not going to, but this is hard.” Talk about that.
[00:06:16] CA: Yes, I just keep thinking of the word unsustainable. It's just unsustainable in my eyes. I mean, but God is the great sustainer. He sustained me through this year. But the workloads are getting more unsustainable, I feel like with IEP meetings, with the increased mental health needs of our kids, covering other teachers has been huge, a huge burden, because so many teachers just walked out after COVID. So, we're all picking up extra duties. Our class sizes have increased. COVID changed the attitude towards in-person attendance, is kind of – for the first time I'm having to attend meetings, where kids have missed 45 days of school, that kind of thing. Because there's just not that push towards in-person attendance, I guess. Digital addictions, expectations that have everything available online, that kind of thing.
I know a lot of people are experiencing increased discipline problems, and all of that. But I've chosen to stay because the reasons I told you before about wanting to be in public school, and just thanks to God's loving kindness. I feel like He has just sustained me in the most trying times. He's given me reminders of why I do what I do in the most amazing timing.
In fact, one day, this year, I was riding to work and crying and praying and crying and praying, and I was literally thinking, “You know what, I'm going to call Jordan. I can't do this anymore. This is ridiculous.” I got to school, I opened up my email, and I had an email from a former student, and it was just such a gift from the Lord that arrived right on time. It was just a great reminder of why I was there. I want kids to achieve their highest potential. I want them to hopefully see Jesus in me and I thought it was funny. I was listening to your podcast with Dr. Francis Collins, and he was describing, I think, it was when he was in a lab.
[00:08:08] JR: Oh, we haven't talked about this. Yes.
[00:08:12] CA: Oh, my goodness. That was an amazing podcast.
[00:08:13] JR: Way better than this one. Amen?
[00:08:17] CA: No, I tell Chris, my husband. I said, “I guess Jordan has had all these amazing guests on and his producer was like, “We got to get the mere, back in mere Christians.”
[00:08:27] JR: Oh, man, jeez. Yes, put them here back, ASAP.
[00:08:31] CA: But he was describing, I guess, for lack of better words, science as just being able to study the odd majesty of God's creation. I was laughing because I was thinking, “Yes, yes.” But for me, this is middle schoolers. I've truly love middle schoolers, and God has put that passion in my heart. I think they are absolutely hilarious and I can't quit that. What other career would allow me to laugh every day and have such honest kids tell me such honest opinions of everything in my life, and about everything going on?
[00:09:05] JR: Hey, if you don't mind, and obviously not using names, taken out personal details, talk about that email you received that morning. What impact did this kid say that you've had in their life?
[00:09:15] CA: Well, she was referencing in particular a conversation that I had with my class on the last day of school. I was telling them how much they meant to me and how they had worth. This particular class was a high achieving class, so I wanted to make sure that they knew that their worth was not in what they achieved in life, and to not listen to lies that might come at them later on in life. If they ever doubted it, they could always come up to the school and I would have a conversation with them. They could email me and I just told them how much I love them, and I enjoyed having them that year. We had really become that particular class was just amazing. We become like a close-knit family.
So, she was really struggling, was telling me she was going through a really dark place, and the conversation that I had with her was circling around in her brain. It was what was getting her through each day. So, I was able to reach out to her and talk with her and get her some counseling as well, obviously. But it was just a sweet reminder. Sorry.
[00:10:21] JR: No, don't be sorry. I mean, this is why you are where you are. This is Jesus's prayer for us in John 17. The Garden of Gethsemane on the mount on Thursday, “My prayer is not that you would take them out of the world, as you sent me into the world. I have sent them into the world.” Right? Where else are you going to have an opportunity? What you told that class, even though you didn't use Jesus's name, I'm assuming, you're preaching the gospel. You were saying, “Hey, you have worth, intrinsic worth, regardless of anything you do.” Something there, that seed was planted in this girl's heart. She felt safe to come to you. We need more people do what you're doing. That's my point.
[00:11:01] CA: Yes, we do.
[00:11:01] JR: So, you're staying, for now?
[00:11:04] CA: Yes.
[00:11:04] JR: This week, today?
[00:11:04] CA: Hopefully, by the time airs, I'll still be there. Yes.
[00:11:11] JR: But get up on your soapbox for a minute. I've heard you get on the soapbox, privately, but like make this plea to our audience, because there's a lot of people right now who understandably, I have a lot of empathy. You have more empathy for these friends, are thinking about leaving working in big corporations that are becoming increasingly “post Christian”. Leaving the public-school system. What would you say them?
[00:11:34] CA: I was just having this conversation with our 10-year-old today, because she kept asking, “Mom, why are you still doing this?” She was helping me clean out my classroom today. “Mom, why are you still doing this?” I said, I explained, one time I was on a cave tour in the middle of – where was it? In the middle of Mexico. What was the city? Taxco? I think. And we went on a guided cave tour hold – stay with me, this relates. We hiked and hiked and hiked into the middle of the cave, and then our guide turned out the light. He was like, “Okay, adios.” My group and I, there were some lights posted on the way, but very, very few and he knew the cave like the back of his hand, so he marched on out, and we just had to stumble through with this a dim light.
I told Eva, “It's like God's gifts that he's given me, hopefully are shining in a dark world. If you remove that light, what glimpse do they have?” I mean, they can see it around them. You know what I mean? I'm not saying I'm the end all be all or something. But you're just extinguishing a little more of that light that can pierce the darkness. I want to be a part of Him redeeming the world. And I don't know, I see no better fit for how He's gifted me than working in the public-school system. Yes, we need more parents involved. We need more Godly teachers. We need more people praying over these kids. We need more mentors. We need more donors. Just the partnership our churches made with public schools in our area. I know it's helped tremendously. It's really the burden off of the elementary school that we partner with. It's just been a witness to the administrators and the teachers.
[00:13:22] JR: Because we're seeking the welfare of the whole city and not just our Christian subculture.
[00:13:27] CA: Yes, exactly. What is it? Philippians 2:4, “We need to look not only to our own interests, but to the best interest of others and the interests of the people in our community.”
[00:13:38] JR: You sent me a text a while ago, pointing to Mordecai as a good case study for this.
[00:13:42] CA: Yes, and you completely ignored it.
[00:13:44] JR: I completely ignored it.
[00:13:45] CA: I mean, you didn't ignore it. You said, “I don't agree.”
[00:13:49] JR: I haven't done the Mordecai devotional series yet and you have an axe to grind. So, here you go. Here's your axe. Grind it.
[00:13:58] CA: I want credit, because it's a fabulous example of how to work in a dark world.
[00:14:02] JR: Tell us why.
[00:14:02] CA: Okay. Well, I did a Ruth and Esther Bible study this year. But I was particularly encouraged by Mordecai’s testimony, because the Bible makes a point to detail how he makes sure he takes care of people in the margins. As we've talked about before, I have a huge heart for English language learners, and immigrants, and parents of immigrants in the school system and that kind of thing. So, I just saw example after example, which apparently you did not see of him taking care of people in the margins. He commanded respect. He didn't insist on an honor for saving his life. He publicly lamented for his people. He obeyed the laws when they weren't contradictory to his faith. He showed proof of what was going on. He didn't spread hearsay. He was then eventually given the King's power. The signet ring. He was a good communicator.
The Book of Esther, it says he translated messages into all the dialects for all of the people. He cared for people near and far. I'm just quoting the Bible, Jordan. So, if you love the Bible and God's word, you would see this. He was a great influence. He had a great reputation. The Bible says he worked enthusiastically for the good of the people. He was an advocate for welfare of all of his descendants. I don't know why you have not already written a devotional. I just basically gave you the main points. So, there you go. You're welcome.
[00:15:23] JR: I appreciate you just calling out my lack of biblical literacy, my lack of care for the world, in such a winsome loving way. No, it is a great case study. It's a great case study. One of the things I'm always struck by in the book of Esther, it's one of two books in the Bible that don't mention God by name. Obviously, He's present. Obviously, He's present on every page. But He's working through Mordecai.
[00:15:48] CA: Yes, He is.
[00:15:50] JR: He's working through Esther. He's working through these mere Christians working in the world, right?
[00:15:54] CA: That's right.
[00:15:54] JR: All right. Mortdecai devotional coming soon.
[00:15:57] CA: Co-authored by Christy Adams.
[00:16:00] JR: Let's do it. Let's do it. Going back to this idea, you use this term before, our Pastor Chris Basham uses it a lot. These terms of installation and isolation, right? Basically, what you're calling for in this episode is, “Hey, Christians, we're not called to isolate Christian subculture, we’re called to engage the world.” But we are also called to insulate, right? We are called to renew our minds with the word, to renew our minds and our spirits, in communion with God. What does that look like for you practically? How are you insulating yourself without isolating from the world?
[00:16:33] CA: Yes, we see this pattern in Jesus's life where He spends time, and He's in prayer, and He has close friends, and then, He goes out in the world. He doesn't just stay with his disciples all the time, obviously. That pattern in my life looks like praying on the way to work, listening to praise and worship music, listening to podcasts that are going to encourage me in the Word. I meet with some ladies every week, every Tuesday night. We've been meeting for several years, and we study through something together in God's Word. We pray together. I have prayer cards on my desk that I use for Bible study I did during COVID that helped me get my mindset straight before kids walked through my doors. I have close friends that encouraged me in the Lord on His Word. For my kids, because they're in public school, we try to help them insulate themselves by talking about the Lord every chance we get. Making sure they're involved in Bible studies and personal devotion time, and praying with them, and that sort of thing.
[00:17:34] JR: Yes. And being in Mr. Jordan’s awesome fifth grade Sunday school class, that has taught them all the things.
[00:17:42] CA: Listen, for those of you – which is everyone because no one knows this. But our 10-year-old came home from her first Sunday school session with Jordan and Kara Raynor. We said, “Well, how was it and what did you learn? What did you talk about?” She said, “I used to have some doubts. But after this one Sunday school lesson, all of my doubts about anything related to the Lord have been answered.” It was really uplifting as a parent. Thank you so much.
[00:18:13] JR: You're welcome. Let's give credit where credit's due. All I did was play a video. The amazing Alpha video on who is Jesus. By the way, Nicky Gumbel founder of Alpha is coming on soon.
[00:18:24] CA: Nice.
[00:18:25] JR: Yes. Hey, if you've got kids, you got to take them to that video. Hey, one more thing before we go that we've never really unpacked. You sent me this email and we never really talked about it. You emailed me after one of my devotionals in this series I did called the Work Beneath Your Work. And it was this email about how I think sometimes we can use work as a painkiller of sorts, right?
[00:18:47] CA: I did not like this email.
[00:18:47] JR: You did not like this email.
[00:18:49] CA: No.
[00:18:49] JR: You said it was super convicting. Why?
[00:18:52] CA: Yes. Stop doing that. Jordan.
[00:18:55] JR: I know. Stop preaching the Word and convicting?
[00:18:56] CA: It was so convicting to me –
[00:18:58] JR: Summarize it for people who haven't read that devotional, because some people don't get my weekly devotionals. If you're missing out, go to jordanraynor.com/blog. I don't know. I should know this.
[00:19:08] CA: Yes. It was just a warning on how we contend to use work as a painkiller, and I really related to that, because I view my work as something maybe the workload is getting more and more demanding and sustainable. But my work is thanks to God's goodness, He's made me great at what I do. I feel confident when I am planning a lesson and I feel passionate, I feel creative. I love coming up with new ideas. I love getting stuff done. I love creating games.
So, when I'm not working and I'm home, and I'm feeling inferior in my mom skills, or whatever I'm doing, or I'm irritated. My pride will creep in and I want to do something that makes me feel more valuable or good, or whatever, instead of feeling weak, and like really needing Him. I tend to use like, “Guys, leave me alone. I got to do some work.” So, I want my kids to go away so I can go back to something that I actually feel skilled at, instead of floundering as a parent or whatever.
That was really convicting, because sometimes this looks like me yelling at my kids, so I can plan a lesson or grade papers or whatever, instead of leaning into that weakness and letting Him grow me in those areas.
[00:20:23] JR: Yes, it's good. I feel the same way.
[00:20:24] CA: Super convicting.
[00:20:25] JR: When I'm in this office, I feel like I'm killing it, and when I go downstairs, I feel like an abject failure.
[00:20:30] CA: My life is a disaster.
[00:20:32] JR: Christy hears me say those words every other time we get together. I mean, I think it's wise to look at it that way, to lean into the things we are clearly called to but are clearly inferior, and so that it increases our reliance on the Lord for the strength to do it. Right?
[00:20:53] CA: Right.
[00:20:55] JR: I also got to point out something, you are the friend in this series. You know who I’m going with this?
[00:21:00] CA: Yes.
[00:21:00] JR: Who called me out on the work –
[00:21:04] CA: I'm so sorry.
[00:21:05] JR: – beneath – no, don't be sorry. I'm going to thank you. All right, so if you’re subscribed to my emails, I sent this email out. I think it was the first email in this series on the Work Beneath Your Work. By the way, if you have no idea what I'm talking about, go find The Work Beneath Work podcast so you can listen to it right now. I said like, “Hey, my temptation, the work beneath my work, the less thing God honoring source of my ambition and drive is performance.” I use my work to try to impress people.
After I sent that email, the next day, I followed up the subject line was something like a humbling PS to yesterday's devotion, whatever. I was explaining how, “Hey, I'm talking about this stuff. But this is still a struggle for me. I was just talking with a friend of mine who was asking me about the Redeeming Your Time retreat. How the retreat went.” And I said, “Oh, it was great. We capped attendance at 25 people and we had a great time.” The point I was making was like, “I sold it out.”
[00:22:03] CA: More people wanted to come on.
[00:22:05] JR: Yes. It wasn't enough to say, “Oh, the retreat was great.” This friend had to know we sold it out.
[00:22:12] CA: And I, trying to be just a wonderful friend and try to be iron sharpening iron, of course, made fun of you, and I said, “Oh, you capped it at 25. Okay. Blah, blah, blah.”
[00:22:22] JR: But here's what I love. Here's what I love. This is what insulation looks like, right? My friend called me out of my crap, because you knew my crap. Because you know the work beneath my work. Hey, thank you for being a friend. Isn't that what the Gilmore Girls said? Thank you for being a friend? Thank you for being a friend.
[00:22:42] CA: Yes, I have hundreds of eighth graders, judgey eighth graders calling me out on my stuff every day. So, imagine.
[00:22:49] JR: And I get you, compared to the hundreds of eighth graders. Christy Adams, you know the drill, the part of this conversation you dread most.
[00:22:58] CA: No. Pass. Can we recap what I said last time? I'm just going to – no, we're going to talk about this for a second. Go ahead. What's the first question and I want to say what I said last time, years ago.
[00:23:11] JR: Which books do you recommend or gift most frequently to others?
[00:23:16] CA: Okay, this is not a lie. But honestly, The Creator in You.
[00:23:21] JR: Stop.
[00:23:22] CA: Because all of our friends are having babies now and they need a great children's book. But I just want to point out that three years ago when I said Harry Potter as my one book, oh, my word. What in the world? That's not even a title of a Harry Potter book.
[00:23:37] JR: Yes, it was bad. That was a bad to answer.
[00:23:39] CA: But you have listened, and you've read several of them, right? You're up to four? Goblet of Fire?
[00:23:45] JR: I'm almost through book four. It's my Sabbath only read. I'm 70% of the way through book four. No spoilers. I'm like 20 years late to the party though.
[00:23:52] CA: That’s okay.
[00:23:53] JR: Christy Adams, who do you most want to hear on this podcast? I think it was Francis Collins. Check that off the list.
[00:24:00] CA: No, stop. I'm not even going to say who I said. Do you want me to say it, honestly?
[00:24:03] JR: Yes, who was it?
[00:24:04] CA: You're going to die. This was three years ago and I said, Kanye West.
[00:24:11] JR: It's amazing.
[00:24:12] CA: What a different world we live in now.
[00:24:14] JR: What a different – I don't think I could do that to Taylor.
[00:24:19] CA: He was living a different life, then we had COVID. Just a lot of stuffs happened.
[00:24:21] JR: A lot of things have happened. All right, what’s your answer now? Who do you want to hear on the show?
[00:24:26] CA: Jen Wilkin.
[00:24:27] JR: Rumor has it Jen might be coming on. Finally. We're both Jen superfans. I think you're the one who got me reading, Jen. Pretty sure.
[00:24:35] CA: Yes.
[00:24:35] JR: All right, Christy Adams, one thing from our conversation you want to reiterate to our listeners in a passionate plea before we sign off?
[00:24:45] CA: Oh, man, we need so many more Christian educators and supporters of the public-school system. Yes, my plea is to insulate yourself and then don't isolate yourself and the public-school system or whatever arena it is, and to not lose hope, and to be light wherever you are, not be overcome by darkness.
[00:25:06] JR: Amen. Hey, I want to commend you for doing that. You are exceptionally talented at what you do. Christy is not going to talk about it, about all the awards and all the accolades she's received as a phenomenal teacher in one of the largest school districts in the country. You're so good at your craft, and your kids love you for it. They respect you for it. Your community respects you for it. I'm just proud of you for sticking with it and staying in a really hard role because of your genuine love of people and wanted to be light to them. Thanks for always calling me out of my crap.
Hang on, wait, hold on. Oh, my gosh, I almost forgot. I'm going to hold you to an answer on the Netflix question before we go. So, if you were a Netflix series –
[00:25:48] CA: We chose your three. I don't know.
[00:25:51] JR: Mine was intense-nal. That was number one.
[00:25:54] CA: Productive.
[00:25:55] JR: A hybrid of intense and intentional. Productive. And we're not going to say it. We're not because then the last one Cara Raynor gave me. What are yours?
[00:26:02] CA: I don't know. All I have is dorky and that's the only one I've come up with.
[00:26:06] JR: Joyful?
[00:26:07] CA: Joyful?
[00:26:06] JR: Dorky is good. Joyful, dorky, loving. People come to you with your problems. Let's get serious again for a second. Your former student, you remember the person you were in a musical last summer. I remember a story about somebody just like unloading on you with all their problems. But seriously, you have a countenance that invites people to share their like hardest things with you. Seriously, what do you think you do to encourage that?
[00:26:35] CA: I don't know. But it's kind of exhausting. Chris says to me all the time. Just don't. Don't go to Target with such an open looking face. I don't know. Perfect strangers.
[00:26:46] JR: You need sunglasses, like avoid eye contact.
[00:26:49] CA: I don't know. But that true. That's a true statement.
[00:26:52] JR: Hey, Christy Adams. Thanks for doing this. I appreciate you, friend.
[00:26:55] CA: Jordan, I appreciate you so much.
[OUTRO]
[00:26:59] JR: Hey, if you are choosing to stay in a “dark place”. I know Christy doesn’t like that term, but you know what I mean. In a public-school system, in a big company that's increasingly hostile to the ways of Christ. I want to hear from you. Contact me at jordanraynor.com/contact, and we'd love to consider having you on the pod.
Hey, thank you guys so much for tuning in this week. I'll see you next time.
[END]